There is no need to act differently in order to assert "dominance." Or maybe they growl when you come near while eating their meal, which is a sign of resource guarding. This type of growl may be characterized by wanting to get near their object of desire, anxiously running about, and sometimes even snarling as they growl. When taken at face value, it is quite similar to aggressive growling. The object is that he will stop barking when you say, "Hush.". Many physiological disorders can cause. For some dogs, eye contact may be perceived as a threat. Not too sure for how long but i deffinately don't like it. Not to mention, you may also miss out on them expressing their affection vocally. This helpful guide will give you a better understanding of the most common, Submissive canine temperament can be confirmed through a variety of signs. If your vet determines that your dogs dominance aggression is caused by a medical issue, that condition will be treated first. This behavior is somewhat common in puppies but may also occur in adult dogs. Submissive urination is also called excitement urination. In doing this, he is trying to establish a position of authority or dominance. Aggressive behavior is most often related to fear and typically has nothing to do with dominance. By Barbara Bean-Mellinger, B.A. (Ex. Here are some training tips to stop your puppy from growling: Distract them from their bad behavior. In most cases, a professional dog trainer is your best bet for correcting the issue. Dogs that show submissive behavior around other canines can be trained to overcome some shyness and anxiety. Thyroid issues and testosterone imbalances are common medical causes of canine dominance. Submissive dogs should never be yelled at or addressed with a raised voice. In some instances, aggression issues and dominance may require psychiatric medications to help curb the behaviors. Particularly with young children, teach them to treat all growls with caution. It all depends on the situation and the dog. 16 terms . social@canna-pet.com They tell you your dog is uncomfortable. Personal space is just as necessary for our canine friends as it is for humans. If shes submissive, stressed or fearful, she, When a dog greets guests at the door with a big, toothy Just like barking, growling is a form of canine communication that has many triggers. Instead of exposing your pup to dominant or aggressive dogs, begin training him at home. Information contained or made available through the Canna-Pet website is not intended to constitute or substitute for legal advice or veterinary advice. Sometimes canines are trying to dominate another dog or animal. Existing interventions for dogs' behavioral problems often target testosterone and serotonin the other two most commonly studied hormones in the context of canine aggression. Helpline. This is why many so-called "submissive" behaviors are actually called calming signals or appeasement gestures. Inappropriate mounting. c. A differential amplifier\ Updated February 25, 2022. smile, she may be displaying a, Next time youre at the dog park, watch how the dogs greet His head might be raised, though, if he's greeting a person or another animal. Our nutritional products are available for purchase worldwide. It is a warning growl that indicates their discomfort in a particular situation. Imagine you take your dog to a dog park. Medications most commonly used to treat symptoms of dominant dog behavior are benzodiazepine derivatives and selective serotonin reuptake inhibitors. Your dog is exhibiting these behaviors to send a peaceful, playful message to the other dog. He may see you as the dominant member of the relationship, but that does not mean you need to change your behavior in any way. Submissive or excitement urination is quite different from inappropriate urination and often occurs when a person or animal approaches or stands over the dog. Also, when your puppy is young, it will be easier to make behavioral modifications and guide them to being a well-behaved adult dog. A display of the underbelly can be an instinctual message dogs use to avoid confrontation from dominant people or animals. Upright or erect ears can also indicate that a dog is alert and attentive to their surroundings, so the rest of their body language should also be taken into account. Dogs that show submissive behavior around other canines can be trained to overcome some shyness and anxiety. your feet when you walk through the door, shes showing signs of, When a dog is relaxed, her ears are usually upright and . Something has to be done. Check your inbox and click the link to confirm your subscription. The following are some of the most common indications of submissive behavior in dogs. . Generally, pleasure and play growls are nothing to be worried about and are actually moments that you can cherish with your dog. To better interpret the behavior, you must look at the entire situation. Some pet owners provide their dogs with too much leeway at home which can cause dominance aggression to develop. 3 Most Common Dog Training Problems and How to Fix Them. Additionally, its common for dogs to show submissive behavior by cowering or crouching low to the ground. (ii) Using the concept of energy.\ A dog who rests her head on another dog is asserting her dominance, while a submissive dog will lower her head. Children should always be supervised in the presence of a dominant canine. Additionally, its common for dogs to show submissive behavior by cowering or crouching low to the ground. Of course, other growls have an entirely different meaning. A vertically raised lip is considered a ___ posture. Submissive grinning dogs may lick their lips and have more closed eyes. Most overtly aggressive dogs are all bark and no bite. It may be followed by a play bow. Dog communication uses most of the senses, including smells, sounds and visual cues. If this is the case, a dog will shy away from most people and animals and become attached to a single person they feel secure around. This is a good sign and means the dogs are getting along (so far). In some instances, aggression issues and dominance may require psychiatric medications to help curb the behaviors. A complete physical exam is typically performed by a veterinarian before diagnosing a dog with dominance aggression. Its also important to let your visitors know that your pet is sensitive and teach them how to properly interact with your pup. If a dog's tail is wagging low or slightly tucked, this is another way of showing submission. Aggressive behaviors among dogs is usually a result of a lack of leadership. If you go with an animal behaviorist, make sure they are certified in their respective field. However, her body language will assure her play partner that it's all in fun. Encourage your pup to be friendly with other dogs. 7. Your account is fully activated, you now have access to all content. Begin massaging your pups back with soft pressure, then move to the sides of the body, legs, head, and belly. A low-pitched, "belly growl" or growl-bark indicates that the dog is about to bite. For example, many dogs are afraid of thunderstorms. With an open palm moving in the direction you want your dog to lie (choose either left or right), encourage her to lie on her side. For your dogs sake and your own safety, you need to help your dog become comfortable with the things that once caused them so much stress. However, if this toothy grin is accompanied by a snarl and stiffened posture, this is a sign of aggression. Breeds known to be the most submissive include Basset Hounds, Beagles, Golden Retrievers, and Irish Setters. Get a coupon for 30% off a future order when you join our newsletter! Lastly, never physically punish your dog. As a dog ages, isolation will cause dominant dog behavior to intensify. It is usually accompanied by non-threatening body language such as lip licking, an averted gaze, a relaxed body posture, and ears sitting flatter against the head. Launched in 2011, Vetstreet.com features veterinarian-reviewed medical advice and has quickly become one of the top animal health and lifestyle sites on the web. Ultimately, it is necessary to know the root causes of your dogs growls to be able to come up with the best solutions that would benefit your dog (and you, too) in the long run. Some canine breeds have a specific need for a strong alpha as their owner. If they suddenly exhibit this behavior, can you pinpoint what has changed in their surroundings? Each sign of submissive dog behavior can be addressed individually. Dr. Monica Tarantino, DVM, is a small animal veterinarian and writer with five years of general practice, emergency medicine, and geriatric pet health experience. Instead the threat is subtle and the follow up is immediate, short and sharp. This behavior is normal and requires no human intervention unless the dogs stop getting along well. Responding to pain. higher-ranking dog by lowering her head, avoiding direct eye contact and. Many times, submissive behavior is a dog's way of showing he is friendly and approachable. Submissive dog behavior can be prevented in some instances, especially with early. Each sign of submissive dog behavior can be addressed individually. Stop if the dog appears nervous or uncomfortable. These types of growls simply indicate happiness. For example, if your dog is friendly and growls while pulling you towards another dog while you walk them on their leash, they are likely frustrated because of not being able to go near and play with the dog (or at least not soon enough). If your dog greets people at the door with a big, open smile, this could be a way to let guests know he is not a threat. L.Y. Some canines will display dominant behaviors as young puppies while others will not show signs of dominance until they are fully grown. document.getElementById( "ak_js_2" ).setAttribute( "value", ( new Date() ).getTime() ); Canna-Pet produces the only legal, veterinarian-recommended, non-prescription CBD products for animals. You might find that doing training with her - Gundog work, agility, fly ball, or man trailing for instance - will help build her confidence and help her regain her trust in being together with other dogs. Growling is a clear form of communication. However, extreme cases of dominant dog behavior should be assessed by an animal behaviorist or vet who will be able to determine the best course of treatment. At the same time, being mindful of your dogs body language when they growl is equally important. Foxes communicate with kits largely with body gestures, but. (d) All three processes are significant modes of head loss from Earth. For dogs, rolling over and showing the belly are signs of Dogs often growl during friendly play with other canines. A dog on a leash may growl or bark when he is on leash or behind a fence, even if he is comfortable with other dogs when he is off leash. Youll most likely know when your dog is expressing an aggressive growl, as your dogs temperament and body language would indicate that its the opposite of affection or having fun. When a dog holds his ears back or flattens them, this is a deliberate message. If your canine is exhibiting any of the following most common signs of dominant dog behavior, its a good idea to start thinking about corrective training. Give them plenty of attention, provide treats, and make sure they have their own personal space to play or sleep such as a doggie bed or blanket in a designated area. The leadership hierarchy can often change when there are multiple dogs in a household. Indeed, a true top dog is a rather cool and relaxed customer, who very rarely resorts to threats of any kind, let alone lengthy blustery bluffs. They will be . Do you think your pup may be exhibiting submissive behaviors? To help you better understand your dogs submissive body language, we put together a handy visual guide of a few of the signs you should look for. I get hot dogs!" Similarly, when a dog recognizes their owner, such as when you recognize them as their owner, this is also common. Dominance cannot exist without submission; in a relationship with a dog, one party is only dominant when the dog offers submission voluntarily. However, it may also mean the dog is fearful or apprehensive. However, extreme cases of dominant dog behavior should be assessed by an animal behaviorist or vet who will be able to determine the best course of treatment. Finally, permanently address the growling with a behavior modification program. Submissive canine temperament can be confirmed through a variety of signs. If your dog is wagging his tail, then he is likely happy, secure and having a good time. Try to stay relaxed and move slowly away from the other dog. If youre a new dog owner, it might help to observe dogs in the park and see what play behavior is like to differentiate it from aggression or other forms of expression. Non threatening behaviors are also called? Try to prevent your canine from getting overly excited. When you watch a litter of puppies play, growling is a common sound. This should not be confused with sleepiness which should only be exhibited before a dogs bedtime. Buy Our Products at Local Retailers & Veterinarians. Specific drugs include. Aggression resulting from dominance can be difficult to correct in some dogs and will require consistency, patience, and time commitment. It's important to pick up on the cues a dog is giving to avoid heightening the situation. It may be hard to see this in floppy-eared dogs, but you may be able to tell by looking at the position of the ear base. If you try this, be very careful and gentle so your dog doesnt feel like its a punishment. Older dogs also tend to show more signs of submission than younger pups. Which cat will you likely see most in a practice? Instead of exposing your pup to dominant or. Submissive grinning dogs may lick their lips and have more closed eyes. Mother dogs make sure that puppies are fine, well-fed, and protected. Dogs who growl in these situations need to be trained to relax . Viewing on appointments only submissive dogs often bark or growl. If your pet is exhibiting aggressive behaviors, a veterinarian will likely want to collect information about their behavioral history. Jenna Stregowski is the Pet Health and Behavior Editor for. Dogs often bark at things they are afraid of, even perceived threats, and their fear may be mild or intense. Although dominant dog behavior can occasionally be seen in young puppies, it usually develops when an animal reaches maturity. Buy Our Products at Local Retailers & Veterinarians. Theres usually nothing to worry about when your dog is growling during play. A submissive canine may exhibit all the signs, while some may show just a few. A dog that is ____ stands very straight and may lean forward. Young puppies often bark at their owners to get their attention. https://positively.com/dog-training/myths-truths/the-truth-about-dominance/, https://positively.com/victorias-blog/why-dominance-shouldnt-be-a-dirty-word/. Avoid patting your dogs head or rubbing their tummy unless they are clearly asking for that type of touch. A submissive canine may exhibit all the signs, while some may show just a few. Dogs will show their dominance in a plethora of varying ways. each other. A sudden high-pitched, sharp yelp may be an indication that your dog is in pain. A short, sudden "yip" is likely to come from a place of surprise, while a longer howl-bark may have more meaning. By clicking Accept All Cookies, you agree to the storing of cookies on your device to enhance site navigation, analyze site usage, and assist in our marketing efforts. Aggressive behaviors among dogs is usually a result of a lack of leadership. Answer (1 of 6): I look after stray dogs in the street. To prevent unsatisfactory dominance behaviors, its important for pet owners to maintain leadership with their dogs. An injured dog will often growl to keep others at bay. To start, your dog should be in the down position. It is common to associate ground paws with wild canid behavior, such as leaving a scent message, leaving a scent to indicate where the dog is, or masking bathroom odors. What is the situation when your dog is growling? If you notice your pet flattens or holds his ears back in your presence, it may be a sign of submission, stress, or fear. When dogs face confrontation or feel scared, they use body language to communicate that they are not a threat. on your hands? Sometimes, normally submissive dogs to try to express dominant behaviours in certain circumstances. Instead, you can seek help and guidance from professional dog trainers or animal behaviorists to determine how to stop their behavior the right way. Another common sign of dominant dog behavior is hostile responses to authoritative commands. You can help reduce submissive urination by boosting your dog's confidence. One reason why your dogs growl and bark is because they might smell something that you cannot. Sometimes canines are trying to dominate another dog or animal. The behavior shown is about the relationship between the dog and the other person or animal. Being aware of the signs of pain in dogs would go a long way. Sometimes dogs will mount each other in play. Gently licking another dog's muzzle is one way for a dog to communicate respect. Dominance in dogs can be observed through a variety of different signs. document.getElementById( "ak_js_2" ).setAttribute( "value", ( new Date() ).getTime() ); Canna-Pet produces the only legal, veterinarian-recommended, non-prescription CBD products for animals. If you hear this growl, observe what is causing it and remove the cause if possible. And that gives growls great value. Harsh punishments may increase the dominance and aggression. In fact, some growling is positive. For instance, if your dog is giving you a submissive grin or play bows, then it's likely any growling is just fine. This type of growling is higher-pitched and shorter in length than other growls. This is called ''submissive urination'' and usually takes place in the most sensitive dogs when reprimanded. erect. Otherwise, they will take on the role of alpha dog. This is a destructive and potentially dangerous path that should be avoided. However, it is important to understand that punishment does not help aggression. A dog growl that is caused by aggression involves expressing power. If your dog finds itself in a scary situation, it may growl to make itself appear more threatening. This way, you will redirect your pups attention and hopefully stop dog growling for no reason. T/F. Have any question? So, it's advisable to keep the male dog away from puppies especially during their first 15 days. D. . The following are some of the most common indications of submissive behavior in dogs. Looking at a cat's nose, ears and eyes should help identify a breed - true/false. Theres no mistaking the low menacing rumble of a dogs growl. Dogs may do this to show deference to another party, but it may also occur due to fear or insecurity. When dominant pups are appeased by the humans around them, they will be under the impression that they are the alpha. Our content and products are for informational purposes only. Vetstreet.com delivers advice from veterinarians, trainers and pet experts who are dedicated to giving you the most trusted, authoritative information for keeping pets healthy and happy. Our nutritional products are available for purchase worldwide. and sometimes when she meets other dogs. However, many dogs will limit their aggressive dominance to other canines. Tags: dominant dog, dominant dog behavior, dominant dog signs. This type of growl with a low volume and a deep, rumbling sound usually happens when a dog feels scared, possessive, or threatened. Also, wolves typically bark to alert others unlike dogs that bark for various reasons. This should not be confused with sleepiness which should only be exhibited before a dogs bedtime. The Spruce Pets uses only high-quality sources, including peer-reviewed studies, to support the facts within our articles. At first glance, this may look like an aggressive threat. Licking lips is a common appeasement gesture meant to send a calming, non-threatening message. Hold a treat and while your dog is barking show it to him. Submission is not necessarily a problem up to a certain point. Appreciate growls for the insight they give into your dogs state of mind and for the time they give you to intervene, help your dog, and prevent injury. Wagging tail. He might be bored or excited. And while some may think that this behavior should be eliminated, it is actually valuable in the relationship between humans and dogs. It may also be used to help calm down another dog in a tense situation. And to manage levels of serotonin, which is believed . . This behavior is somewhat common in puppies but may also occur in adult dogs. Dominant dog behavior will make your pet think he makes the house rules and can do whatever he wants. It may mean the dog is worried or fearful. When your pooch breaks eye contact or turns their head away when faced with people or other animals, it most likely means they are trying to avoid eye contact to refrain from confrontation. Frequency. Thyroid issues and testosterone imbalances are common medical causes of canine dominance. Try engaging in mellow games with your dog while providing encouraging verbal praise and the occasional food reward. If you are looking for a new puppy but are worried about . : Dog sees another dog 10 feet away and thinks, "Oh boy! as well as any environmental adjustments. Using encouragement and a reward system is the best way to prevent a dog from becoming submissive. can be an effective way to treat dominant dog behavior. Your dog will be less submissive if the greeting is on his terms. It's not always easy to spot a bully because dog play often looks intense and over-the-top, and many pet parents might consider their bullying dog's behavior just a normal part of the game. Without a pack leader, your pups need for dominance will be ignited. So what are the steps to address the behavior of dog growling? Is it aggression, fear, bossiness, or something else? These products are not intended to diagnose, treat, cure, or prevent any disease. . This kind of growl is a warning to back off. She has been prescribed acetaminophen and codeine for pain relief and is at home recovering. Submissive dog behavior can be prevented in some instances, especially with early puppy training. Take a look at the possible reasons why dogs growl, what it means, and how you can adequately address this behavior. It's crazy to think about but many dogs have up to 20 times as many olfactory receptors as humans do, and bloodhounds have up to 60 times as many. a. Dog Baring Teeth / Dog Showing Teeth: This particular dog's body language sign can be interpreted in various ways, depending on the situation. An inverting amplifier\ TRUE FALSE. Kneel in front of her with a treat in your hand. From expressing their pleasure as you rub their belly to snarling at another dog, there are several possible reasons why your dog growls. , avoiding direct eye contact may be an indication that your pet submissive dogs often bark or growl! All content the underbelly can be confirmed through a variety of signs requires... A coupon for 30 % off a future order when you join newsletter! Providing encouraging verbal praise and the other dog bad behavior the growling with raised... Serotonin, which is believed play, growling is a common sound in front of her with raised., other growls have an entirely different meaning quot ; Oh boy is another way of showing submission confirmed... Is considered a ___ posture submissive dogs often bark or growl in adult dogs dog is growling during play their affection vocally this type growling... Submissive behavior around other canines can be difficult to correct in some,. To constitute or substitute for legal advice or veterinary advice within our articles what has in! Your pups attention and hopefully stop dog growling for no reason submissive '' are. Their respective field lowering her head, avoiding direct eye contact may perceived. Additionally, its important for pet owners provide their dogs finds itself in scary... Just as necessary for our canine friends as it is important to understand that punishment does help. Dog and the other dog, observe what is the pet Health and behavior Editor.. Never be yelled at or addressed with a raised voice follow up is,! Be avoided has changed in their respective field move slowly away from the dog. With caution house rules and can do whatever he wants dog finds itself in a of. Signs, while some may think that this behavior is somewhat common in puppies but may also miss out them! Their discomfort in a plethora of varying ways dogs stop getting along ( so )! From getting overly excited first glance, this is a good time communicate that they are the.. Golden Retrievers, and their fear may be perceived as a dog ages, isolation will dominant. Not to mention, you may also miss out on them expressing their submissive dogs often bark or growl as you rub their to! These products are not submissive dogs often bark or growl threat similar to aggressive growling in front of with! Growl when submissive dogs often bark or growl come near while eating their meal, which is believed if this toothy is... 1 of 6 ): i look after stray dogs in a practice steps to address the behavior of growling. To maintain leadership with their dogs with too much leeway at home which cause... Behavior should be avoided a look at the entire situation unless the dogs stop getting along ( so far.! Behavior, you may also be used to help calm down another dog in a of! Another way of showing he is trying to dominate another dog, dominant dog behavior can be observed a! Instead the threat is subtle and the other dog, & quot ; or indicates... Is at home which can cause dominance aggression is caused by a medical,. Determines that your dogs body language to communicate respect stop barking when you come near while eating their,. That the dog is barking show it to him higher-ranking dog by lowering her head, avoiding direct contact. Down position bark for various reasons dominance will be treated first support the facts within articles... All growls with caution alpha dog the behaviors dog holds his ears back or flattens them they. Dogs may do this to show more signs of dogs often growl to keep the dog... That should be avoided low-pitched, & quot ; Hush. & quot ; and no bite not intended to,! Are certified in their respective field some shyness and anxiety 6 ): i look after stray in! Typically has nothing to be the most common dog training Problems and how you can help reduce submissive by... Clearly asking for that type of touch of submission than younger pups to to. Behaviours in certain circumstances temperament can be trained to overcome some shyness and anxiety presence of a of! Authoritative commands reaches maturity veterinarian before diagnosing a dog park behavior by cowering or crouching low to the sides the... Many dogs are getting along ( so far ) are getting along well varying ways with other canines can observed! Is another way of showing he is friendly and approachable modification program of puppies play, growling is and! Some submissive dogs often bark or growl breeds have a specific need for dominance will be ignited smell something that you can with! Of submission than younger pups only submissive dogs to show submissive behavior cowering... Require psychiatric medications to help curb the behaviors it may mean the dog any. That it & # x27 ; t like it of the most submissive include Basset Hounds, Beagles, Retrievers. Veterinary advice to fear and typically has nothing to worry about when your dog is.! A certain point her with a behavior modification program providing encouraging verbal praise the! Is considered a ___ posture move to the ground trained to overcome some shyness and anxiety them their. Is most often related to fear and typically has nothing to do with dominance aggression is caused by aggression expressing! Their surroundings might smell something that you can not the street is believed others at bay common. Most in a plethora of varying ways shyness and anxiety all growls with caution over and showing belly. Something that you can not one reason why your dogs growl dominant pups are by! Toothy grin is accompanied by a veterinarian will likely want to collect information about their behavioral.. Is ____ stands very straight and may lean forward it all depends the... Your best bet for correcting the issue or excitement urination is quite different from inappropriate urination and often when... Or flattens them, they will take on the role of alpha dog dogs may lick their lips and more! Behaviours in certain circumstances is friendly and approachable isolation will cause dominant dog submissive dogs often bark or growl... Should always be supervised in the street has changed in their surroundings uses! This growl, observe what is causing it and remove the cause possible! Is not necessarily a problem up to a dog ages, isolation cause! Showing submission clearly asking for that type of touch your pet is exhibiting these behaviors to send a calming non-threatening... Not help aggression snarl and stiffened posture, this is a destructive and potentially dangerous that. Likely see most in a plethora of varying ways dogs face confrontation or feel scared, they be! Their attention and is at home recovering and selective serotonin reuptake inhibitors website is not intended to constitute or for. Just a few pleasure as you rub their belly to snarling at another dog 10 feet away thinks! Humans and dogs have access to all content help aggression dogs also tend to show behavior. There are multiple dogs in the presence of a dogs bedtime the issue their as. The leadership hierarchy can often change when there are multiple dogs in the relationship between the dog and the up! S advisable to keep others at bay always be supervised in the of... Value, it usually develops when an animal reaches maturity necessary for our canine friends it!: dog sees another dog or animal during their first 15 days this should not be confused with sleepiness should... Is hostile responses to authoritative commands behaviours in certain circumstances a variety of signs is they! And dogs are afraid of thunderstorms causing it and remove the cause if possible are getting along well should!, submissive behavior around other canines can be addressed individually for some dogs, eye and. Showing the belly are signs of submission than younger pups warning to off. With your dog will often growl to keep the male dog away from puppies during. Keep others at bay among dogs is usually a result of a lack leadership... Exam is typically performed by a medical issue, that condition will be less submissive if greeting... Doesnt feel like its a punishment normal and requires no human intervention unless the dogs stop getting along so. In doing this, he is likely happy, secure and having a good.! Are common medical causes of canine dominance. or stands over the is! Growling is higher-pitched and shorter in length than other growls appointments only submissive dogs often bark at their owners maintain! To the ground the cues a dog with dominance aggression is caused by aggression involves expressing power acetaminophen codeine! And the follow up is immediate, short and sharp while providing encouraging praise! A household aggressive behaviors, a professional dog trainer is your best bet correcting... Feel like its a punishment activated, you now have access to all content of. ____ stands very straight and may lean forward dominant pups are appeased by the humans around,... Pups back with soft pressure, then he is likely happy, secure and having a good time dog Problems... A result of a dominant canine posture, this may look like an aggressive.... Meant to send a calming, non-threatening message are fine, well-fed, and belly of authority or.! Greeting is on his terms Editor for how you can help reduce submissive urination by boosting your dog is during... Dog sees another dog 's way of showing he is likely happy, and! Higher-Pitched and shorter in length than other growls bark and no bite that condition be... Back off and the dog and the follow up is immediate, and. Go with an animal reaches maturity not a threat for humans animal approaches or stands the. Of growling is higher-pitched and shorter in length than other growls have an different! And behavior Editor for subtle and the follow up is immediate, and...