It shouldnt surprise anyone that individualism might contribute to inequality or at least, as Henrich puts it, the justification of inequality. I think I would have been perfectly content there because its also still a country of such huge opportunity. Michele Gelfand again: GELFAND: This American teenager from Ohio, Michael Fay, was in Singapore and was arrested and charged with various counts of vandalism and other shenanigans. Europe has a strong influence from Germany, also from France. So, today on Freakonomics Radio: can we really build a model that explains why the American psyche is so unusual? No difference, that is, between tight and loose cultures. So that can be very beneficial. And as long as you dont kill somebody behind the wheel of a car, your right to do whatever you want to do to yourself is protected. After all, they were the data set. Heres what Hofstede told us last week about culture: HOFSTEDE: If youre part of a society, youre like one drop in the Mississippi River. I came back to Colgate. So the U.S. produces the sort of Wal-Mart equivalent of religions: big churches giving the people what they want, high pageantry. Its waiting to happen because people in this individualistic, indulgent society, they want to be merry. Capital W-E-I-R-D, which stands for: HENRICH: Western, educated, industrialized, rich and democratic. SFU will never request our users provide or confirm their Computing ID or password via email or by going to any web site. Geert Hofstede ( 2 October 1928 - 12 February 2020) was born in a peaceful country, but his teenage years saw the second World War rage across Europe. to let him focus even more on this data. During the Cold War. The negotiations didnt work out. We do this on vacations with my siblings. At the time, opinion surveys were relatively new; it was especially unusual for a company to survey its own employees. Listen to this episode from Freakonomics Radio on Spotify. The answer to that is usually: no, you cant. If you dont feel that, then you will be an unhappy person. We can think about extraordinarily loose contexts like Tesla or Uber that probably need a little more structure. The downsides: less innovation, less openness to ideas that challenge the status quo, and less tolerance for differences in religion and race. HOFSTEDE: Its rather futile to advise somebody what their national culture should be because theres no way you can change it. Well find out what it means to be WEIRD although not weird in the way youre thinking. Then he tried a coffee can with a money slot in its plastic lid, which also proved too tempting. Its called long-term versus short-term orientation. And this dynamic leads to a lot of fighting for the sake of fighting. GELFAND: Apparently over 50 percent of cats and dogs in the U.S. are obese. Essentially, theyre the opposite of the loose attributes: tight cultures have more coordination and more self-control. HOFSTEDE: He did social psychological work on what it is to be a manager. One of the defining features of Americanism is our so-called "rugged individualism." You might even call it wild individualism. There are plenty of looser people in tight countries and vice versa. Fascinated by the human in the system, he did a PhD in organizational behaviour. What was I.B.M. Each week, Freakonomics Radio tells you things you always thought you knew (but didn't) and things you never thought you wanted to know (but do) from the economics of sleep to how to become great at just about anything. And you need revolutions in order to change the government. For example, we asked bank managers some years ago to look through scenarios of people violating organizational rules, like coming to work late, staying on the phone too long, maybe checking their email. DUBNER: When I look at the loosest country in the data, I see Ukraine. But one of the things thats happened, particularly in the context of social media in the last 10 years, is that people now can speak back to power and close the gaps in terms of where individual people see themselves in relationship to power. Its like, Oh, my gosh, that is so amazing. I was feeling like I have to tell that to my kids as a good parent, training my kids to be vertical and individualistic. HENRICH: Two players divide a sum of money. And its another dimension on which the U.S. is a substantial outlier. Just like good science, good . In 1994, a small incident in Singapore turned into a big deal in the United States. Like, the military should be tighter than tech. Individualism has had a tremendous impact, not only on culture, but on social theory as well, and political philosophy in particular. But even a loose country will tighten up when a threat arises. Models couldnt capture the civil rights movement the individual genius that could emerge in any particular historical moment, whether its Ella Baker or Martin Luther King, and the idea that you have these individual moments of brilliance that then come together to create this just historically unique moment. So if you ask people to judge the absolute lengths of two lines, people in more individualistic societies tend to get that right. Whereas if you have a state religion, it tends to get tired and old and boring. (Part 1 of "Freakonomics Radio Takes to the Skies.") 58 min. Bush made clear to Iraqs Saddam Hussein that this wouldnt stand. GELFAND: I really had a lot of culture shock. HENRICH: So, Francisco is a good pal of mine and hes also a very charming fellow. The other point is a reminder: Its good to be humble about our ability our inability, actually to predict how a given culture will change. Individualism places great value on self-reliance, on . And there are other inconsistencies, especially in a country as large and diverse as the U.S. For instance, where you live. Gelfand says the countries that were most aggressive in trying to contain Covid tended to be tighter countries. That, again, is Gert Jan Hofstede. GELFAND: If youre in contexts where theres a lot of rules, you develop from a very early age that impulse control. If you read the passage above and use a typical 6% agent/broker commission schedule, 3% seller and 3% buyer agent/broker, then the home owner/seller takes a $10K hit on the value of the total sale price where the agents/brokers only take a $600 hit. A dream team of directors e. DUBNER: So I have to say, Gert Jan, youve made me feel kind of terrible about being American today. Caning as in a spanking, basically, on the bare buttocks, with a half-inch-thick rattan cane. But somehow, that diversity and that early celebration of permissiveness has overridden that. In indulgent societies, more people play sports, while in restrained societies, sports are more something you watch. And that really can help explain some variation not all, but some variation in norms and values. He was a professor in both the economics and psychology departments, which was weird in its own way lower-case weird since Henrich had never taken a course in either subject. The Pros and Cons of America's (Extreme) Individualism: With Stephen Dubner. DUBNER: Name some of the highest and lowest countries on this dimension. Sometimes incentives will be obvious, but often they will be hidden - and . You realize, you want a black or white value judgment. On a certain level, this is obvious: These are cultures that have norms and traditions that have endured for centuries. According to a decades-long research project, the U.S. is not only the most individualistic country on earth; we're also high on indulgence, short-term thinking, and masculinity (but low on "uncertainty avoidance," if that makes you feel better). So the scientific discipline of psychology is dominated by Americans. Every action or every fact or every move has a system around it. the benefits to an individual from study and engagement in a topic. The U.S. patent database goes back into the 18th century and what a number of studies in economics as well as work in my lab has shown is that openness to other people so, trust in strangers, an inclination towards individualism, a desire to stand out, to be the smartest guy in the room fosters more rapid innovation because people are more likely to exchange ideas, theyre more interested in distinguishing themselves. That is something that fundamentally many whites dont understand, right? The Pros and Cons of America's (Extreme) Individualism (Ep. Michele Gelfand has another example of how culture shapes perception. Its part of our founding D.N.A. And it should stay there. The Coronavirus Shutdown Is Revealing Americas Troubling Obsession With Work, Those Who Stayed: Individualism, Self-Selection and Cultural Change During the Age of Mass Migration, A Rising Share of the U.S. Black Population Is Foreign Born, 10 Minutes with Geert Hofstede on Indulgence versus Restraint, 10 Minutes withGeert Hofstede on Masculinity versus Femininity, 10 Minutes with Geert Hofstede on Individualisme versus Collectivisme, Dimensionalizing Cultures: The Hofstede Model in Context, A Re-Inquiry of Hofstedes Cultural Dimensions: A Call for 21st Century Cross-Cultural Research, The Churching of America, 1776-2005: Winners and Losers in Our Religious Economy, Horizontal and Vertical Individualism and Achievement Values: A Multimethod Examination of Denmark and the United States, Hofstedes Model of National Cultural Differences and Their Consequences: A Triumph of Faith A Failure of Analysis. So, what is it? Freakonomics takes the tools used in microeconomic analysis and puts them to work in novel situations, by looking at the individual decisions made by experts such as real estate agents or car salesmen, by consumers of the services these experts offer, and by other individuals like parents. GELFAND: I grew up on Long Island. DUBNER: And Im guessing youre the spontaneous type. HENRICH: One study of the journals in social psychology shows that 96 percent of all subjects in social psychology come from societies that are Western educated, industrialized, rich, and democratic. Heres another culture metaphor another watery one from the Dutch culture scholar Gert Jan Hofstede. Stay up-to-date on all our shows. Dubner speaks with Nobel laureates and provocateurs, intellectuals and entrepreneurs, and various other underachievers. My husband is an attorney. Innovation requires coming up with a lot of ideas. Whereas looking away in a very egalitarian society is seen as a sign of deceptiveness. GELFAND: Places in the South have tended to have more natural disasters. In our previous episode, we made what may sound like a bold claim. Let me give a little background. DUBNER: But that the research subjects, they gave him a lot back and they thought it was going to him. Theres far less stigmatization of people in terms of their race, their religion. And the research subject explained to him that, Oh, I feel so bad for you that you cant afford pants without holes in them that I cant take the money from this poor American kid. And it struck me as a way in which this experiment could be perverted. But its important to acknowledge that no culture is a monolith. His ideas, along with others, are credited with . And this paper was basically sitting in the shelves of libraries for many years. GELFAND: In cross-cultural psychology, we study how ecological and historical factors cause the evolution of differences. HOFSTEDE: And blue-collar. Theyre longing for it. China is also very collectivistic and so are the Southeast Asian countries, but not Japan. There were a number of low offers of 15 percent, which didnt get rejected. According to a decades-long research project, the U.S. is not only the most individualistic country on earth; we're also high on indulgence, short-term thinking, and masculinity (but low on "uncertainty avoidance," if that makes you feel better). And not attending enough to contextual factorsopportunities that presented themselves, being in the right place at the right time. My uncles like, Hey, I have something to show you. My first day in America, he showed me the Macys Thanksgiving Day Parade. For some Americans, at least, working hard is a badge of honor. You had Woodstock, and youre going to have this kind of stuff happening again. The first ten amendments to the Constitution (collectively known as the Bill of Rights), for example, are all about protecting individual rights from government power. According to the individualist, all values are human-centred, the individual is of supreme importance, and all individuals are morally equal. Whereas people from less individualistic societies tend to be better at making relative-size judgments. It was a collaboration between Hofstede the Elder, his son Gert Jan, whod begun working with him by now, and a Bulgarian linguist named Michael Minkov, who had been analyzing data from the World Values Survey. Its hard in either direction not just because some cultures are tighter than others. So I did the experiment there with an indigenous population called the Machiguenga. Theres a good side of every dimension, including uncertainty avoidance. Wade meant that these unwanted children were not being bornthus, they could not grow up to be criminals. But a lot of the world is much more like a family. Lets flip it for a moment. In the U.S., it was freedom to do whatever the hell that you wanted to. Relatedly: Americans place a high value on being consistent across different situations. She says these are merely visible indicators of a countrys tightness or looseness and its what you dont necessarily see that shapes a given countrys culture. Freakonomics is a registered service mark of Renbud Radio, LLC. And he said the reason was that he was a young postdoc, and he had holes in his jeans. This is the dimension based on data from the World Values Survey. The Pros and Cons of America's (Extreme) Individualism. Freakonomics Radiois produced by Stitcher and Renbud Radio. Episode 470 The Pros and Cons of America's (Extreme) Individualism. Freakonomics tries to decipher everyday events from an economic perspective by exploring various events, such as drug dealers lives, the truth about . Stripped of our culturally acquired mental skills, he writes, we are not so impressive when we go head-to-head in problem-solving tests against other apes, and we certainly are not impressive enough to account for the vast success of our species. Henrich recently followed that book with another one called The WEIRDest People in the World: How the West Became Psychologically Peculiar and Particularly Prosperous. So looking decisive, muscular, active or if youre a woman, sexy that makes you more status-worthy. As Hofstede the Younger remembers it, his father asked his bosses at I.B.M. Okay, lets get into the six dimensions. HOFSTEDE: For the U.S.A., the world is like a market. We often look to other countries for smart policies on education, healthcare, infrastructure, etc. Good on you. GELFAND: The U.S. tends to not just be individualistic, like Hofstede or others have shown, but very vertical, very competitive in its individualism. This is where he combines all his academic interests: not just economics and psychology, but also anthropology and evolutionary biology. Educated. You may decide to go another way, but that doesnt make the river change. Hes horrified by my dishwasher-loading behavior. Individualism encompasses a value system, a theory of human nature, and a belief in certain political, economic, social, and religious arrangements. Its trying to include all the stuff that we acquire as a consequence of growing up in different environments, and contrast that with things like our sex drive, which doesnt seem to be acquired by observing others. And this led to this project where we did in lots of places hunter-gatherers, pastoralists, Africa, Papua New Guinea. HENRICH: My favorite explanation for this I think this has been put out most clearly by a sociologist named Rodney Stark is that with freedom of religion, you get competition amongst religious organizations. And that happens a lot. The fourth original dimension was called uncertainty avoidance. This has to do with how comfortable people are with ambiguity. Hence the term, the changing same. I think there are historical moments that are transcendent. By late 2009, the book had sold over 4 million copies worldwide. The Aztec, the Inca, and todays Mexico, Colombia, Venezuela, are very collectivistic. HOFSTEDE: Yes. Macroeconomics, on the other hand, works on a larger scale. Words: 777. Individualism once . You always have to win. Needless to say, it's had a lot of success. And I think that is a hallmark of African-American culture in this country. And well see if the pandemic may have just maybe relaxed the American habit of work, work, work. China, Japan, and Turkey are also tight. Neal is a professor of African and African-American studies. Heres another example: HENRICH: People from more individualistic societies tend to focus on central objects. Which one of the four options below is NOT mentioned as a determinant of social mobility in neighborhoods? So the general rules of a loose or tight culture may not be consistently applied to all populations. GELFAND: Well, we can look back to Herodotus. Like, you can buy them on the internet. He did some work in the factory and it shaped him to a great extent because there, he could see that the world of the organization looks so differently from the floor than it does from above. DUBNER: Im curious for advice on how we should balance weve become an economic powerhouse, and we recognize that there is a lot of benefit to that. And when I started to work with Harry Triandis, who was one of the founders of the field, I thought, Wow, this is a super-interesting construct. But, lets look at the pandemic from a different angle: which country produced the most effective Covid-19 vaccines? It turns out that Americans were among the least likely to conform. And thats because the vast majority of the research subjects are WEIRD. If you no longer even pretend to be one people and to be fair to all the citizens of your country, then youre not going down a road that leads to a great future. The first player needs to offer enough money to satisfy the second player or the first player gets nothing. The converse, which is what Anglo societies are high on, means you dont care about ambiguity. We owe much of our freedom to that influence. BROADCASTER: The subject denies the evidence of his own eyes and yields to group influence. Joe Henrich again: HENRICH: In some societies, people really attend to scent, and they have a complex set of language terms that have the equivalent of basic color categories for scents. We had a lot of struggles with tightening during Covid, clearly. Theres some D.N.A. Freakonomics is a groundbreaking collaboration between Levitt and Stephen J. Dubner, an award-winning author and journalist. A tight country like Germany tends to set strict limits on noise, with mandated quiet hours. New York City, meanwhile, has been called not just the city that never sleeps, but the city that never shuts up. Tight countries tend to have very little jaywalking, or littering or, God forbid, dog poop on the sidewalks. Heres one of the questions they asked. HOFSTEDE: And it immediately yielded a four-dimensional model. . Im a professor of artificial sociality at Wageningen University, in the Netherlands. There is some overlap between these six dimensions and some of the ideas we talked about in last weeks episode particularly the notion that some national cultures tend to be tight and others loose. DUBNER: I like those rules. We look at how these traits affect our daily lives and why we couldnt change them even if we wanted to. Theyre not supposed to be the boss. Our staff also includesAlison Craiglow,Greg Rippin,Joel Meyer,Tricia Bobeda,Mary Diduch, Zack Lapinski,Emma Tyrrell, Lyric Bowditch, Jasmin Klinger,andJacob Clemente. It is that the wealth comes first, and the individualism follows. Henrich takes a more nuanced view: HENRICH: To explain the massive economic growth that weve seen in the last 200 years, you need to explain the continuous and, for a long time, accelerating rate of innovation that occurred. Thats the cross-cultural psychologist Michele Gelfand. It always was unsustainable, but was made even more acute to us during the pandemic. How does the U.S. do on this dimension? 470. We should be nice to one another. But when push comes to shove, most of the time it doesnt go that way. on one axis and religiosity on the other axis, the U.S. is a clear and distinct outlier with high G.D.P and high religion. Insight, for the authors (economist Steven Levitt and journalist Stephen J. Dubner) is all about explaining behaviour in terms of the incentives and dis-incentives (rewards and penalties) that drive it. And so you walk faster because you cant get everything you need done in your day and youre always trying to get to the next event. Here are some things that tend to thrive in highly individual societies: human rights, a free press, divorce, and a faster pace of life. At school in the Netherlands, Ive seen a mother ask her two-year-old, Shall I change your nappy? And then the child gets to decide whether its nappy gets changed. And it should stay there. employees in more than 50 countries. A loose country, like the U.S., tends to do well in creativity and innovation; in tolerance and openness; in free speech and a free press. HOFSTEDE: But it turned out that lumping them by nationality was the best thing to do. He veers tighter. In a large power-distant society, you have autocracy. But yes, its all workplace. We will leave you with a patriotic tribute from one last transplanted U.S. comedian. Freakonomics is a book about 'freaky' research and insight. This dimension measured short-term versus long-term orientation in a given country; it also helped address the relative lack of good data from Asia in previous surveys. We put in a bunch of other checks and controls. Well, because theyre really smart. All contents Freakonomics. When Hofstede the Elder went to work for I.B.M., he got involved with these surveys. That was our hypothesis, at least. Culture is about, if you are a part of a society, youre like one drop in the Mississippi River. BUSH: Allied air forces began an attack on military targets in Iraq and Kuwait. Also, the people who settled in different areas in the U.S. brought with them their own cultural norms and values, and set the stage for different levels of tight-loose within the nation. This is a pretty interesting result: one stranger giving away roughly half their money to another stranger when, theoretically, 10 or 20 percent would keep the second player from rejecting the offer. We just need to do it. In a society of small power distance, a lot. NEAL: We think about improvisation in the context, obviously, of creative and musical terms, but its also a way of always having to adapt to the changing political, social, and cultural realities. The second player is given a choice between accepting or rejecting. HOFSTEDE: Yes, of course. GELFAND: This has always been the big question, that with the internet and globalization were going to become more similar. And thats going to cultivate certain tonal abilities, which could feed into certain kinds of music, and things like that. we're looking out for the best interest of our individual pursuits. You may have noticed that Hofstede neglected to mention a certain country that we Americans tend to care about quite a bit. That, again, is Mark Anthony Neal, from Duke. Gelfand wanted to learn where theyd get the most help. It's an unnatural activity that has become normal. I do this for you and you do this for me. Folks who come from a collective standpoint where, I do this for you, but youre doing this for us thats a very, very different way of seeing the world. Now that weve taken a top-down view of how the U.S. is fundamentally different from other countries, were going to spend some time over the coming weeks looking at particular economic and social differences, having to do with policing, child poverty, infrastructure, and the economy itself. In restrained societies, people tend to suppress bodily gratification, and birth rates are often lower; theres also less interest in things like foreign films and music. Web site from one last transplanted U.S. comedian to focus on central objects checks. Strict limits on noise, with a money slot in its plastic lid, which stands for::... 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